String Inlay on Lolling Chair arm support?

A

awleonard

Well-known member
I'm considering bhilding a couple of lolling chairs.  One thing I have sen that I like is a bit of sring inlay on the legs and the front arm support.  As I pondered this, I started wondering if there is a trick to installing the inlay on a face that is concave?  Basically it appers that you have to bend the inlay around the wider section where you normally bend it the other way.  Any tips? 

Also, most of the designs I have seen have a 90° corner where the arm and the arm support meet.  I have seen a few that hae an arm that extends further than the support.  I like the idea of extending the arm for comfort.  No sharp corner to rest your arm on and no sharp corner when you use the arm to push up.  Just thinking out loud here really. 

I happened to see Norm build a chair on day as I was in between projects and my wife has been looking at adding a couple of chairs to the great room, so I thought this might be a good project.  I just happened to have a couple of really big pieces of 12/4 mahogany that I bought years ago when a wood dealer moved to a smaller home.  I've been saving it. 

Thanks and Happy Holidays to all,


Tony
 
If you cut your string inlay 1/16 by 1/16 you should not have any problems.  I have done a few chairs where the front of the arm is inlayed and it curves around on the top or end of the horizontal arm section in a tight radius. 

Pete Aleksa
www.cherrybrookwoodworks.com
 
Thanks Pete.  I'll probably do some practice work before I try it on my mahogany.  I have the DVD's that Steve Latta produced, so that will help. 

Glanced at your website and your work is beautiful!  Your lolling chair is really nice.  I bought my wife the DVD of Craft in America (PBS series) season 2 and they did a segment on Bennet Street.  I'd love to go through the program.  Part of the problem of being a weekend warrior is that we don't take the time to practice/focus on the fundamentals.  Too focused on "building something!" 

Thanks for the help.  I'm sure I'll have more questions if/when I start these chairs.

Tony
 
Ill use water based dyes and or alcohol based and the top coat is whatever the client wants, usually shellac or lacquer or something more durable(rarely) I do explain the pluses/minuses of each finish and let them choose.   
 
Once you get your stringing to size rub it against a heated rounded surface to bend it. A pipe with a flame a small soldering iron. Works for me. Be careful not to burn yourself speaking from experience.
 
Tony- I don't think you'll be needing that 12/4 for the lolling chair- save it for some cabriole legs! I've got one on my website that I did for the Gardiner-Pingree house at the PEM in Salem-Al
 
Yeah, I do hate to slice into that stash.  That was my original intent - to save it for leg stock.  I have a couple of pieces about 7" x 8' or so.  I have only used a small piece of it and it was nice wood.  Trouble is, it is really hard to find mahogany these days.  That found is usually outside my budget.  I may look at some mahogany substitutes.  There is one source around here that sometimes has thicker stock (here being Memphis, TN).  I'm not that concerned about the material being "correct."  Heck, I've seen poplar dressed up that would fool any non-woodworker type...and we have plenty of that around here!  Actually, now that I think about it, I built a settee many years ago and stained the show part of the poplar legs and they look pretty good.  Sorry if this kind of talk is sacrilege to many here! Of course staining would pose a problem if I decide to add the stringing.  Hmmmm...

Thanks for the inlay tips.  I've never done any, so I appreciate the advice.  I have seen several different methods of creating the groove.  Scratch stock, Steve Latta's tools at LN, etc.  May try the scratch stock or make a tool similar to Steve's and see what I like best. 

Thanks for the reference to your chair  Allan.  I like the treatment at the base of the arm support.  That is a little unique to others I have looked at.  How about comfort of these chairs?  We're spoiled these days with everything being overstuffed and super comfy.  Perhaps that is part of our obesity problem?  Don't want them too comfy (so that guests don't overtsay their welcome!), but I would like to be able to sit in one long enough for a good conversation or a good magazine read. 

Thanks,

Tony
 
Tony- They're pretty comfortable, although I usually don't get to sit in my chairs because they go to the uoholsterer's after me and then on to the owner..
I would make the chair out of birch and stain it to look like mah. That's what they did pretty often in the period and it's hard to tell. Birch has a very similar grain structure to mahogany and takes a  red-brown stain nicely. Poplar is, well, yucky. But that's my personal bias... . so you can ignore that.-Al
 
Thanks.  We do have alot of birch around here too.  Haven't seen any lately, but I haven't been looking.  Actually, I started woodworking via a Woodworking 101 class at our local university and we used birch to build a small Shaker table.  The instructor had gotten a real good deal on 1000 bdft or so (it was a very big stack!). 

Anyway, thanks for the input and I'll be back to ask more if/when I get started.  I've built one settee of my own design and a side chair in a class, I am not quite a rookie at making chairs - meaning a few more before I'll move UP to rookie status.  The angles are a bit to digest.  We built a nice chair in the class, but we didn't learn HOW to make a chair.  My settee was simple and all the lines were vertical, so I just made a jig to cut the cheeks.  Nice thing about using birch or poplar is that I can afford to make mistakes!

Tony
 
Tony- The nice thing about a lolling chair is that the back from the seat up is a separate frame that's notched into the seat rails and scarfed to the rear legs, which just go about 10" or so above the seat. That way the primary wood is only used below the seat and the back is probably stronger for it.-Al
 
The joint that Al talks about is shown on my website if you are interested.  Go to www.cherrybrookwoodworks.com  under "articles" click on Antiques and Fine Art magazine.  You can see how the Portsmouth Lolling chair goes together.   
 
Actually, I had seen your chair page by searching Google I think.  Nice work!  I like the serpentine front.  makes it look less boxy. 

So, how did you cut the angled tenons for the side rails?  I have several ideas that would all work, but I' like to hear from a pro.  I made a jig for the TS when I made a settee that held the rail at the corect angle.  That worked ok as far as I can recall (that was many years ago).  Then I thought it might be easier to rough cut the cheeks on the tenon jig and then cut the shoulders by hand (scribe and then chisel them in). 

Tony
 
Use a mortiser and set your legs on an angled cradle. I haven't seen a cross grain  angled tennon on an original that I can think of other than those I have repaired and have forgotten. My brain isn't what it ever was and I guess it will not ever again be what it never was. Just something for someone else to think about!
 
I have seen alot of them that way as well.  If you are going to cut everything by hand, thats probably how I would do it-  Its easier to lay out and cut that way.  But, I dont do it all by hand.  Theres more than one way to skin the cat... 
 
Thanks.  That's interesting.  I assumed the angled tenon was the way to go because that is what I have seen mostly.  But then I just saw an article by Garrett Hack where he buids a chair and does just what you suggest (used a router though).  I wonder if it makes any difference once it is all glued up?  Your method sounds a little easier. 

Thanks,

Tony
 
So, I got to thinking about this, the shoulders still have to be angled.  How do you cut those?  Rather than building jigs, I thought it might be easier to rough at the TS then finish them by hand.

Tony
 
Tony-It depends how many you're making. If you're doing one, it's pretty easy to lay everything out and cut by hand. I'm with Jeff- I've never seen an angled tenon on a period piece, they go straight off the line of the rail. If I'm doing a set of chairs I'll cut the compound angled shoulders on the sled on the saw and dado blade away most of the rest. You can make compound angled mortises with a plunge router with an angled base attachment very fast, but you need left and right beds for the base-or you can make an angled bed for the mortising machine, which is pretty efficient also. Put your legs in two separate piles way apart from each other so you don't end up with all left or right legs..........Al
 
I think your approach should be based on the equipment you have and  your approach to being a "purist".  If you have the time and want to do everything by hand, chop your mortise out by hand and cut your tenon by hand straight off the rail with angled shoulders that can be quickly chopped by hand.  I havent seen "old" ones an other way and thats a great way to do it if money is NOT involved.  OR, if you have a mortiser, rip a piece to the trapezoid angle to support your leg in the mortiser, then cut the tenon by hand- OR cut your mortise square to the face of the leg and take your tenon of a shaper in one pass(like a single end tenoner). Stack two rabbeting bits on the spindle with machinist spacers, make a sled with hold downs(important), cut a wedge to the trap. shape to support your piece, and to cut your tenons consistently to within thousandths of an inch so all are press fit.  And if you do it this way, might as well run extra parts b/c in the time it takes you to saw/chop mortises for one chair, I'll have the joinery done for multiple chairs.  I suspect techniques like this on this website, people dont want to hear about or have no interest in and thats fine.  You really cant argue about the strength of a "cross grain"  angled tenon.  Cut one, stick it in a vise and see.  If there is that much pressure side ways on a joint to cause failure....its all going to fail.  My training(outside of school) and multiple working shop experiences over the years have all been based on making $ which means fast accurate production.  I dont think there is anything wrong with either approach.  I just know which one will put $ in my pocket.  If $ or time isnt involved, dont over analyze it, take the approach which will allow you to have fun and improve your skill.

 
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